I was somewhat surprised at the vitriol expressed last night against Richard Stallman. I was aware of his statement about Epstein but not the other accusations.
I understand that sexual abuse allegations should not be ignored but also that because it is an emotional topic allegations often depart from reality.
Here is one of many articles defending Stallman:
https://stallmansupport.org/debunking-false-accusations-against-richard-stal... https://stallmansupport.org/debunking-false-accusations-against-richard-stallman.html
-- Bill
On 2021-06-09 Bill Reid wrote:
I was somewhat surprised at the vitriol expressed last night against Richard Stallman. I was aware of his statement about Epstein but not the other accusations.
I understand that sexual abuse allegations should not be ignored but also that because it is an emotional topic allegations often depart from reality.
Here is one of many articles defending Stallman:
You should have stayed for the after-meeting, we discussed it more at length.
I defended Stallman vigorously, and that's really saying something as I'm fully aware Stallman is far, far (far far far FAR) left and I am unabashedly on the right.
Arguably not many of us would be here in this club, using Linux and GNU (etc) if it weren't for Stallman. What he did for FLOSS, GNU/Linux, FSF, GPL, etc is incalculable. To memory hole his contribution and turn his name into Lord Voldemort is truly abhorrent.
If he committed crimes, he should be given due process and tried in a true court of law. I am in no way defending anything illegal he may have done.
If he was just "weird", well that's 99% of MUUG members. If he was just "creepy", well that's like many whose mindset got stuck in "free love" 1969 (I can't speak to that as I wasn't born yet). If he committed actual crimes, then he should be punished to the full extent of the law, within the law, as we'd expect of anyone. Weinstein got Stallmanned (or was it the other way around?) but at least they legally convicted him of actual crimes in the end, _proving_ that he's a certifiable sleazebag.
Many on the right sit back and laugh at the "left eating itself", but I don't: I find it as disturbing when Stallman gets "Kavanaughed" as when Kavanaugh got Kavanaughed. It's evil, and very dangerous.
One of the things that makes our community so vibrant and interesting is the assortment of extremely odd, often abrasive, personalities. Linus with his expletive-filled rants; Stallman who was one of the weirdest personalities in FLOSS; "out" Maddog Hall; ... I've greatly enjoyed watching and reading these autists and weirdos over the last two decades, even when what they are saying is directly against my personal philosophy. And now they've neutered Linus with the COC a couple of years back, and successfully canceled Stallman. We're losing some of the most interesting sides of the strongest voices. These are the voices that built so much. Going forward, can the weak, neutered voices create as much value and progress as the "oddballs" did? Maybe, by definition, you have to be loud and odd to push the technology curve? I'm not a Musk/Tesla fan, but he's of the same vein, and I watch with great interest as the left slowly turns on him.
So we lose the pioneers and all we're left with is Poettering?? Thanks, cancel culture.
My question is, who with power wanted Stallman gone, and why. This doesn't just happen spontaneously. Cui bono.
(I'll read your link with great interest in a sec, Bill.)
Thanks Trevor for your comments about Stallman. Well written.
I have not really read much recently about Stallman but I agree with a lot of what he is for but not quite as rigid or doctrinaire . Your comment about Stallman being far... left got me curious since I really never have read anything about his political views. From his website this page from March 2021 talks about what he feels are necessary changes in Society. Some of them are already what we enjoy in Canada and I did not find much to disagree with. Clearly left but certainly not far left.
https://stallman.org/articles/necessary-changes.html https://stallman.org/articles/necessary-changes.html
-- Bill
On 2021-06-09 3:17 p.m., Trevor Cordes wrote:
I defended Stallman vigorously, and that's really saying something as I'm fully aware Stallman is far, far (far far far FAR) left and I am unabashedly on the right.
On 2021-06-09 Bill Reid wrote:
Thanks Trevor for your comments about Stallman. Well written.
Thanks also.
I won't argue left vs far left, since it's subjective and, more importantly, irrelevant to the point I was trying to make. I only brought it up to illustrate that, if anything, I should be biased _against_ Stallman, yet here I am defending his right to voice his (often appalling) opinions (I mostly vehemently disagree with) without being professionally destroyed. If nothing else, his contributions should have earned him much wider pause, leeway, understanding, and tolerance.
But, alas, tis the nature of the culture at the moment. I could go on and on for a very long time, so I'll leave it here. Perhaps we can chat in person further at a future meeting. I also look forward to hearing what others have to say. Shocking that so many are silent whilst witnessing the destruction of an icon.
I really have no knowledge of the Stalman situation but just wanted to strongly disagree. Someone's contributions to a given field should not grant them any leeway whatsoever.
All people should be held to the same standards of behaviour regardless of their social standing. Otherwise we end up with powerful people abusing their privilege. That is sadly the reality in today's world and "cancel culture" is the resulting backlash against that inequality.
As with most social corrections there will be people that will argue the pendulum has swung too far but that doesn't change the fact that it needed to swing.
John
On Thu, Jun 10, 2021 at 1:40 AM Trevor Cordes trevor@tecnopolis.ca wrote:
On 2021-06-09 Bill Reid wrote:
Thanks Trevor for your comments about Stallman. Well written.
Thanks also.
I won't argue left vs far left, since it's subjective and, more importantly, irrelevant to the point I was trying to make. I only brought it up to illustrate that, if anything, I should be biased _against_ Stallman, yet here I am defending his right to voice his (often appalling) opinions (I mostly vehemently disagree with) without being professionally destroyed. If nothing else, his contributions should have earned him much wider pause, leeway, understanding, and tolerance.
But, alas, tis the nature of the culture at the moment. I could go on and on for a very long time, so I'll leave it here. Perhaps we can chat in person further at a future meeting. I also look forward to hearing what others have to say. Shocking that so many are silent whilst witnessing the destruction of an icon.
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