Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it. It's Linux or Win7. If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7. Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done? Corollary: What distro?
I gave my mother-in-law Ubuntu on an old desktop. It worked fine for her (email, web, and Skype). When the hardware died, we got her a new laptop with Windows 8.1. It also works fine for her. Gerald On Feb 12, 2014, at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca> wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
Does she use Quickbooks/Quicktax/etc? On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca> wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
On the topic, curious what people think about SaaS options vs the desktop options. I've been very happy with mint.com for my personal finances. Wave is pretty good for businesses (my major gripe was the bank import, but they've moved to Yodlee so that should be better) I used ufile for the past 2 or 3 years for taxes after using QuickTax every year since ~94. I've had more "notice of reassessments" from the CRA since I've started doing that, though. Actually really pissed off at them because despite filling out a form they didn't efile it to the CRA and I got into a huge mess. My taxes are a bit more complicated than average but not such that I feel the need to send to an accountant. SaaS makes the choice of desktop OS less important, IMHO, and can provide a better experience than desktop if done right. Sean On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 8:32 AM, Colin Stanners <cstanners@gmail.com> wrote:
Does she use Quickbooks/Quicktax/etc?
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca>wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
Continuing on the topic (or slightly off-topic) of tax software, especially the online/cloud offerings, I switched from QuickTax to UFile in tax year 2007 and never looked back. During an overlap test, both produced identical results, but I switched because QuickTax was much too cumbersome/obtuse and non-Intuitive (which makes my comments here on-topic re "mom-ready"). Though UFile uses a similar "interview" style, it doesn't send me in endless circles the way QuickTax did, and UFile doesn't produce nearly as many irrelevant and often erroneous caution/"error" notices. Also, UFile online allows you to catch up with returns as far back as 2000 (though CRA only lets you go back 10 years). I've never been re-assessed, and my return even includes a T2125 for business/professional. So, I'm a happy UFile camper. As a true aside, note that the current Netfile no-go applies to all tax software and is expected to be cleared up within days from now. It is CRA-triggered by the requirement for a late-stage update to all tax software that produces ".tax" files for uploading to Netfile. Hartmut Sager On 12 February 2014 08:50, Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> wrote:
On the topic, curious what people think about SaaS options vs the desktop options.
I've been very happy with mint.com for my personal finances. Wave is pretty good for businesses (my major gripe was the bank import, but they've moved to Yodlee so that should be better)
I used ufile for the past 2 or 3 years for taxes after using QuickTax every year since ~94. I've had more "notice of reassessments" from the CRA since I've started doing that, though. Actually really pissed off at them because despite filling out a form they didn't efile it to the CRA and I got into a huge mess. My taxes are a bit more complicated than average but not such that I feel the need to send to an accountant.
SaaS makes the choice of desktop OS less important, IMHO, and can provide a better experience than desktop if done right.
Sean
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 8:32 AM, Colin Stanners <cstanners@gmail.com>wrote:
Does she use Quickbooks/Quicktax/etc?
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca>wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
Oh, I meant to ask: When you used the term "Efile", did you really mean Efile rather than Netfile? Efile is only available to CRA-registered tax preparers. Hartmut Sager On 12 February 2014 14:05, Hartmut W Sager <hwsager@marityme.net> wrote:
Continuing on the topic (or slightly off-topic) of tax software, especially the online/cloud offerings, I switched from QuickTax to UFile in tax year 2007 and never looked back. During an overlap test, both produced identical results, but I switched because QuickTax was much too cumbersome/obtuse and non-Intuitive (which makes my comments here on-topic re "mom-ready"). Though UFile uses a similar "interview" style, it doesn't send me in endless circles the way QuickTax did, and UFile doesn't produce nearly as many irrelevant and often erroneous caution/"error" notices.
Also, UFile online allows you to catch up with returns as far back as 2000 (though CRA only lets you go back 10 years).
I've never been re-assessed, and my return even includes a T2125 for business/professional. So, I'm a happy UFile camper.
As a true aside, note that the current Netfile no-go applies to all tax software and is expected to be cleared up within days from now. It is CRA-triggered by the requirement for a late-stage update to all tax software that produces ".tax" files for uploading to Netfile.
Hartmut Sager
On 12 February 2014 08:50, Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> wrote:
On the topic, curious what people think about SaaS options vs the desktop options.
I've been very happy with mint.com for my personal finances. Wave is pretty good for businesses (my major gripe was the bank import, but they've moved to Yodlee so that should be better)
I used ufile for the past 2 or 3 years for taxes after using QuickTax every year since ~94. I've had more "notice of reassessments" from the CRA since I've started doing that, though. Actually really pissed off at them because despite filling out a form they didn't efile it to the CRA and I got into a huge mess. My taxes are a bit more complicated than average but not such that I feel the need to send to an accountant.
SaaS makes the choice of desktop OS less important, IMHO, and can provide a better experience than desktop if done right.
Sean
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 8:32 AM, Colin Stanners <cstanners@gmail.com>wrote:
Does she use Quickbooks/Quicktax/etc?
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca>wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
Yes, I meant NetFile. I think I've been reassessed all 3 years I've used it. Most of it had to do with credits not being applied transferred correctly with my spouse. The biggest problem was when I filled in a T657 (calculating capital gains deduction) that they never sent. I went back and forth with their support who were unhelpful. I eventually printed it off from the PDF they give you and mailed it to the CRA and things worked out. Sean On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 2:50 PM, Hartmut W Sager <hwsager@marityme.net>wrote:
Oh, I meant to ask: When you used the term "Efile", did you really mean Efile rather than Netfile? Efile is only available to CRA-registered tax preparers.
Hartmut Sager
On 12 February 2014 14:05, Hartmut W Sager <hwsager@marityme.net> wrote:
Continuing on the topic (or slightly off-topic) of tax software, especially the online/cloud offerings, I switched from QuickTax to UFile in tax year 2007 and never looked back. During an overlap test, both produced identical results, but I switched because QuickTax was much too cumbersome/obtuse and non-Intuitive (which makes my comments here on-topic re "mom-ready"). Though UFile uses a similar "interview" style, it doesn't send me in endless circles the way QuickTax did, and UFile doesn't produce nearly as many irrelevant and often erroneous caution/"error" notices.
Also, UFile online allows you to catch up with returns as far back as 2000 (though CRA only lets you go back 10 years).
I've never been re-assessed, and my return even includes a T2125 for business/professional. So, I'm a happy UFile camper.
As a true aside, note that the current Netfile no-go applies to all tax software and is expected to be cleared up within days from now. It is CRA-triggered by the requirement for a late-stage update to all tax software that produces ".tax" files for uploading to Netfile.
Hartmut Sager
On 12 February 2014 08:50, Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> wrote:
On the topic, curious what people think about SaaS options vs the desktop options.
I've been very happy with mint.com for my personal finances. Wave is pretty good for businesses (my major gripe was the bank import, but they've moved to Yodlee so that should be better)
I used ufile for the past 2 or 3 years for taxes after using QuickTax every year since ~94. I've had more "notice of reassessments" from the CRA since I've started doing that, though. Actually really pissed off at them because despite filling out a form they didn't efile it to the CRA and I got into a huge mess. My taxes are a bit more complicated than average but not such that I feel the need to send to an accountant.
SaaS makes the choice of desktop OS less important, IMHO, and can provide a better experience than desktop if done right.
Sean
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 8:32 AM, Colin Stanners <cstanners@gmail.com>wrote:
Does she use Quickbooks/Quicktax/etc?
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca>wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
Ah yes, I can see that spousal and transfer matters are an area of complications that would get much more scrutiny, and would cause trouble if UFile's ".tax" file for Netfiling leaves something out. Hartmut Sager On 12 February 2014 14:59, Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> wrote:
Yes, I meant NetFile. I think I've been reassessed all 3 years I've used it. Most of it had to do with credits not being applied transferred correctly with my spouse. The biggest problem was when I filled in a T657 (calculating capital gains deduction) that they never sent. I went back and forth with their support who were unhelpful. I eventually printed it off from the PDF they give you and mailed it to the CRA and things worked out.
Sean
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 2:50 PM, Hartmut W Sager <hwsager@marityme.net>wrote:
Oh, I meant to ask: When you used the term "Efile", did you really mean Efile rather than Netfile? Efile is only available to CRA-registered tax preparers.
Hartmut Sager
On 12 February 2014 14:05, Hartmut W Sager <hwsager@marityme.net> wrote:
Continuing on the topic (or slightly off-topic) of tax software, especially the online/cloud offerings, I switched from QuickTax to UFile in tax year 2007 and never looked back. During an overlap test, both produced identical results, but I switched because QuickTax was much too cumbersome/obtuse and non-Intuitive (which makes my comments here on-topic re "mom-ready"). Though UFile uses a similar "interview" style, it doesn't send me in endless circles the way QuickTax did, and UFile doesn't produce nearly as many irrelevant and often erroneous caution/"error" notices.
Also, UFile online allows you to catch up with returns as far back as 2000 (though CRA only lets you go back 10 years).
I've never been re-assessed, and my return even includes a T2125 for business/professional. So, I'm a happy UFile camper.
As a true aside, note that the current Netfile no-go applies to all tax software and is expected to be cleared up within days from now. It is CRA-triggered by the requirement for a late-stage update to all tax software that produces ".tax" files for uploading to Netfile.
Hartmut Sager
On 12 February 2014 08:50, Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> wrote:
On the topic, curious what people think about SaaS options vs the desktop options.
I've been very happy with mint.com for my personal finances. Wave is pretty good for businesses (my major gripe was the bank import, but they've moved to Yodlee so that should be better)
I used ufile for the past 2 or 3 years for taxes after using QuickTax every year since ~94. I've had more "notice of reassessments" from the CRA since I've started doing that, though. Actually really pissed off at them because despite filling out a form they didn't efile it to the CRA and I got into a huge mess. My taxes are a bit more complicated than average but not such that I feel the need to send to an accountant.
SaaS makes the choice of desktop OS less important, IMHO, and can provide a better experience than desktop if done right.
Sean
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 8:32 AM, Colin Stanners <cstanners@gmail.com>wrote:
Does she use Quickbooks/Quicktax/etc?
On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca>wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- Sean Walberg <sean@ertw.com> http://ertw.com/
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
You'll have to judge for yourself what she can cope with. I'm just glad I switched my Dad from XP to 7 a couple of years ago as he's no longer especially agile, mentally. Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2014, at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca> wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
Off topic but I used StudioTax last year which as far as I know is the only completely free (as in beer) tax software that also includes netfile. I had no problems but my taxes are pretty simple. Unfortunately It's Windows only. Back on topic; personally, if the needs are just email, browser and skype, I'd go with a tablet. I prefer Android tablets because it integrates with Google in an optimal way and for my personal stuff that works for me. John On Wed, Feb 12, 2014 at 8:52 AM, Kevin McGregor <kevin.a.mcgregor@gmail.com>wrote:
You'll have to judge for yourself what she can cope with. I'm just glad I switched my Dad from XP to 7 a couple of years ago as he's no longer especially agile, mentally.
Sent from my iPhone
On Feb 12, 2014, at 5:13 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca> wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux. She only needs an office suite (OOo instead of Word should do), Skype (works fine on linux, and her webcam is supported), an email app (evolution/thunderbird instead of Outlook), and that's about it.
It's Linux or Win7.
If I'm setting up and admin'ing, are there any downsides really? I can make it look/behave much like XP, so the learning curve may be smaller than with Win7.
Am I delusional because I breathe Linux? Or can this be done?
Corollary: What distro? _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- John Lange www.johnlange.ca
On 12/02/14 05:13 AM, Trevor Cordes wrote:
Faced with an expiring XP, I had a thought about moving my mother (complete techno-luddite) to Linux.
My dad meets that description (minus the mom part, hence subject line change) and has been using Debian and Ubuntu for around 8 years now. He now has way more cumulative time on this (web, email, spreadsheet) then the small amount of intro to computer course work he got under Windows first -- it was too little exposure to get him hooked. This is all he's known in retirement time where almost daily computer use has been picked up as a habit and wasn't a computer user at all pre-retirement. And no, I do not have a tech support burden. It's easy to please a user with really simple needs. And they'll be thankful for system reliability if they know anything about other people's horrors. You're doing them a favour by not giving them the ability to click their way to installing something from hell. If they ask for some little app they found on the web, don't try to make some little app work with Wine, just say "no, live without it". And if using Windows they should definitely be taken away from admin privileges to an unprivileged account and instructed to get advice before flipping to admin account before installing anything. (this is good advice for everyone!) Even legit software like Oracle Java for Windows comes with freaking unneeded toolbar installers to opt out of during the install process! Somebody needs to pay attention and not just click, click, click...! Speaking of reliability, I don't recommend Ubuntu's regular 6 month releases, every major upgrade on any platform has snafus, the availability of LTS every two years is the way to go. Ditto, don't do Fedora, just don't. Advanced users are obviously in heaven in the free world. Intermediate users like my Mom, who's been a Mac user since before the turn of the century and an Amiga before that are a much harder sell. The big fuzzy middle users in computing are always pushing the boundaries of what their computer can do, but from a consumer perspective that expects things to "just work". (every advanced user, regardless of platform is someone who deals regularly with things that don't "just work" and require an operator to handle them properly. Some of us even have jobs doing this) And these intermediates are naturally the target market for developers of non-commodity applications. (Bookkeeping, yes, being an issue for many, though I like GnuCash myself. Tax processing not so much now an issue now as there are now plenty of web-based services for that. This is what my parents use without any help from me) I suppose world domination has to come from the edges inward. Which reminds me: There's a lot to not like about Android from a freedom perspective, but if we're talking moms and dads using an invisible kernel named Linux, it's a pretty big success with over 1 billion activations world wide. (not sure how many of them are >60) Of course, we're not really talking about "Linux" or Android here, we're talking about GNU/Linux distros like Ubuntu as a desktop OS choice. Maybe world domination of such users some day will be Replicant (free Android) X86-64 attached to big monitor, keyboard, mouse, CPU, and plenty of RAM. (long live the desktop computer! Especially for parents with poor vision and no desire to get gorilla arm using a touch screen for hours of browsing pleasure Mark p.s. Gorilla arm http://www.catb.org/jargon/html/G/gorilla-arm.html gorilla arm: n. The side-effect that destroyed touch-screens as a mainstream input technology despite a promising start in the early 1980s. It seems the designers of all those spiffy touch-menu systems failed to notice that humans aren't designed to hold their arms in front of their faces making small motions. After more than a very few selections, the arm begins to feel sore, cramped, and oversized — the operator looks like a gorilla while using the touch screen and feels like one afterwards. This is now considered a classic cautionary tale to human-factors designers; “Remember the gorilla arm!” is shorthand for “How is this going to fly in real use?”.
You're doing them a favour by not giving them the ability to click their way to installing something from hell. If they ask for some little app they found on the web, don't try to make some little app work with Wine, just say "no, live without it".
I probably also said, "would you like to spend $1xx.xx on a Windows Retail License?" seeing how we were working with a whitebox built from parts.
On 2014-02-12 Mark Jenkins wrote:
I probably also said, "would you like to spend $1xx.xx on a Windows Retail License?" seeing how we were working with a whitebox built from parts.
Thanks for everyone's input. Yes, a cost of "free" is also a bonus if we go with Linux, though it would not be the sole deciding factor. I think I may give Linux a try. I will certainly report back with the results, in a few months. An eye towards a "LTS" type distro would certainly be desirable, though I'm already adept at keeping 20+ Fedora boxen updated (entirely remotely/headless!) to the latest version every year (every 2 releases, when support ends). As for tablets, I'm not sure moving parents in that direction is ideal. For one, they don't like change. Second, I don't think she'd like the ergonomics. Third, I'm not convinced tablets are the "future", in the sense that desktops will completely disappear (anyone remember netbooks, they were the "future" once too!). I like tablets for what they are good for, the odd lookup of something while watching tv, or casually keeping up with junk mail. I would never sit at a tablet to do serious (wordy!) email or composing some essay in a word processor!! The clunky interfaces aren't even great for my style of web browsing, where I tend to middle-click the next twelve links and peruse from there. I won't even get into the thought of doing all my programming and admin work on a tablet! I think I'd go all hari-kari. But that's a whole other discussion!
I switched my father from Windows XP to linux several years (7?) back because it was easier for me to support at the time. I would not rate it a success and he has since switched to a MAC (which is also a failure but that's another story). Just some of the reasons: 1. Lack of a reasonable Email client that compares to Outlook. 2. Support for scanning documents is horrible. Assuming you can even find a scanner that works, there is no good scanning software on Linux. 3. OpenOffice documents are not 100% compatible with Office (though arguably, Office versions are also not compatible with each other so that may not be fair). 3. And most importantly, lack of support. My father uses his computer for his consulting business and I work full time. I can't support him during business hours and there is no place else to go. You can't just walk into Staples with your laptop and ask for help. There were lots of other frustrations over the years that I've blocked out of my memory. If you're just doing basic stuff like web browsing, then _maybe_ Linux would work for you but you have to live with a lot of limitations related to browser incompatibility, plugins etc. For example, will you're banking site work? I said it in the other thread, for basic use I'd go with an Android tablet hands-down. It requires minimal if any hands-on support, and it's also very well supported out on the web with apps for pretty much everything. And you can't beat the price. John On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 2:37 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca> wrote:
On 2014-02-12 Mark Jenkins wrote:
I probably also said, "would you like to spend $1xx.xx on a Windows Retail License?" seeing how we were working with a whitebox built from parts.
Thanks for everyone's input. Yes, a cost of "free" is also a bonus if we go with Linux, though it would not be the sole deciding factor.
I think I may give Linux a try. I will certainly report back with the results, in a few months. An eye towards a "LTS" type distro would certainly be desirable, though I'm already adept at keeping 20+ Fedora boxen updated (entirely remotely/headless!) to the latest version every year (every 2 releases, when support ends).
As for tablets, I'm not sure moving parents in that direction is ideal. For one, they don't like change. Second, I don't think she'd like the ergonomics. Third, I'm not convinced tablets are the "future", in the sense that desktops will completely disappear (anyone remember netbooks, they were the "future" once too!). I like tablets for what they are good for, the odd lookup of something while watching tv, or casually keeping up with junk mail. I would never sit at a tablet to do serious (wordy!) email or composing some essay in a word processor!! The clunky interfaces aren't even great for my style of web browsing, where I tend to middle-click the next twelve links and peruse from there.
I won't even get into the thought of doing all my programming and admin work on a tablet! I think I'd go all hari-kari.
But that's a whole other discussion! _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- John Lange www.johnlange.ca
I'm curious about how the Mac isn't working out. I'm default tech support for my daughter's, and it's pretty painless so far. I got her set up initially with disk encryption (in case lost), Time Machine for backups, and just poke and prod now and then for updates. Oh, and she's got her non-default admin ID. On the email client side, what does Thunderbird lack that your father needs? One need I've found with family is decent backup options. Other than Time Machine for the Mac users, I am leaning towards getting them set up with CrashPlan. Even in freebie mode, it's powerful enough, and basically stays out of the way for backups to local storage or another system. Having tinkered with it myself, I am anticipating that it will beat the snot out of the, "I forgot to copy all that stuff over that I NEEEEEEEEEED!" Cheers, Tim On 2/13/2014, 9:39 AM, John Lange wrote:
I switched my father from Windows XP to linux several years (7?) back because it was easier for me to support at the time. I would not rate it a success and he has since switched to a MAC (which is also a failure but that's another story).
Just some of the reasons:
1. Lack of a reasonable Email client that compares to Outlook. 2. Support for scanning documents is horrible. Assuming you can even find a scanner that works, there is no good scanning software on Linux. 3. OpenOffice documents are not 100% compatible with Office (though arguably, Office versions are also not compatible with each other so that may not be fair). 3. And most importantly, lack of support. My father uses his computer for his consulting business and I work full time. I can't support him during business hours and there is no place else to go. You can't just walk into Staples with your laptop and ask for help.
There were lots of other frustrations over the years that I've blocked out of my memory.
If you're just doing basic stuff like web browsing, then _maybe_ Linux would work for you but you have to live with a lot of limitations related to browser incompatibility, plugins etc. For example, will you're banking site work?
I said it in the other thread, for basic use I'd go with an Android tablet hands-down. It requires minimal if any hands-on support, and it's also very well supported out on the web with apps for pretty much everything. And you can't beat the price.
John
On Thu, Feb 13, 2014 at 2:37 AM, Trevor Cordes <trevor@tecnopolis.ca <mailto:trevor@tecnopolis.ca>> wrote:
On 2014-02-12 Mark Jenkins wrote: > > I probably also said, "would you like to spend $1xx.xx on a Windows > Retail License?" seeing how we were working with a whitebox built > from parts.
Thanks for everyone's input. Yes, a cost of "free" is also a bonus if we go with Linux, though it would not be the sole deciding factor.
I think I may give Linux a try. I will certainly report back with the results, in a few months. An eye towards a "LTS" type distro would certainly be desirable, though I'm already adept at keeping 20+ Fedora boxen updated (entirely remotely/headless!) to the latest version every year (every 2 releases, when support ends).
As for tablets, I'm not sure moving parents in that direction is ideal. For one, they don't like change. Second, I don't think she'd like the ergonomics. Third, I'm not convinced tablets are the "future", in the sense that desktops will completely disappear (anyone remember netbooks, they were the "future" once too!). I like tablets for what they are good for, the odd lookup of something while watching tv, or casually keeping up with junk mail. I would never sit at a tablet to do serious (wordy!) email or composing some essay in a word processor!! The clunky interfaces aren't even great for my style of web browsing, where I tend to middle-click the next twelve links and peruse from there.
I won't even get into the thought of doing all my programming and admin work on a tablet! I think I'd go all hari-kari.
But that's a whole other discussion! _______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca <mailto:Roundtable@muug.mb.ca> http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
-- John Lange www.johnlange.ca <http://www.johnlange.ca>
_______________________________________________ Roundtable mailing list Roundtable@muug.mb.ca http://www.muug.mb.ca/mailman/listinfo/roundtable
participants (9)
-
Colin Stanners -
Gerald Brandt -
Hartmut W Sager -
John Lange -
Kevin McGregor -
Mark Jenkins -
Sean Walberg -
Tim Lavoie -
Trevor Cordes